Update: And it turns out that Moore's first two accusers are far from credible. Leigh Corfman has a history of making false allegations against pastors, and Deborah Gibson is a longtime Democrat who has been a volunteer for Moore's opponent in the Senate race:
The mainstream news media are saying almost nothing about these facts.
Has anyone noticed that the accuser who says Moore signed her yearbook (Beverly Nelson) is still refusing to turn over the yearbook for forensic examination? Has anyone heard about the fact that another one of Moore's accusers has also made harassment allegations against a pastor and that those allegations were deemed to be baseless? Have you heard about any of the dozens of character witnesses who have known Moore since he was young and who are coming forward to defend his character? Beverly Nelson is not only claiming that Moore signed her yearbook but she is claiming that Moore tried to force her to engage in sexual activity. Moore and his attorney have challenged her to allow handwriting experts to examine the alleged yearbook entry. Why is she refusing to let independent experts examine the entry?
Colin, actually I'm a Mo Brooks supporter -- but he lost the primary election. There's plenty for me to disagree with in the political statements of Mr. Moore. Regardless of whether the target is my friend or my enemy, I would not jump to conclusions about who did what to whom. In any story in which I have been personally involved, the media has reported "the facts" incorrectly. The original WaPo story is so cunningly contrived that it is worth studying. On second reading, ask yourself what facts are actually known and what details are lined up to imply a whole lot more than can be proven. Still more questions than answers. My heart aches for all the victims here. But my head does not yet know which are the real victims.
Andersen should read this: https://www.theatlantic.com/politics/archive/2017/11/the-ignorance-of-mocking-mormonism/545975/?utm_source=atlfb
This is just a means to an end. If Moore gets voted in by the people then does the Party get to decide he can't served the office he was elected to by the people? The Party is trying to take away our vote when it doesn't go their way.
I have no idea if Mr Moore is guilty or not. It just seems odd these women are bought onto the public stage when right candidate isn't winning.
I tend to agree with the two Susans and with Larry. I also ask the question that begs an answer, especially among practicing Mormons who believe in the Atonement of Christ: when do we allow a person to repent and be forgiven of past mistakes, if they did occur, especially when they have lived a life that indicates a change for the good? I do not made a personal decision concerning Judge Moore and the allegations against him. Timing bothers me, especially after all these many years. I also look at what the Savior said to those sinners who brought the woman taken in adultery to him to judge her and to trap Him, "Let him who is without sin, first cast a stone at her." Especially in the Church, our leadership would be very sparse if everyone who has a calling never made a mistake in their life. Let us allow people to repent and make a difference for good in the world.
As a Latter-day Saint, I am embarrassed by the rapid rush to judgement made by our brothers. The counsel to judge not or to judge a righteous judgement has been ignored. After almost two centuries of false accusation and false testimony against the Prophet Joseph Smith, we should be among the slowest to believe "political hit pieces."
We might be missing the fire because of the smoke. None of the publicity about these accusations is encouraging the idea of being chaste; rather it is making a case against UNWANTED sexual activity. And that's a good start. But immoral behavior is wrong in the eyes of God, not just when it's forced or non-consensual, or when someone gets caught, and that doesn't seem to be the message that is coming through. The concept of chastity is missing in the rhetoric. I realize, of course, that national media is not the best vehicle for sending the message of God's laws----that's why General Conference, the Church itself, parents, teachers, Prophets, & Meridian Magazine, etc. etc. are such great blessings.
To answer Colin's question, the principle behind the rule of law is that one standard of judgment applies to everyone. We have lately seen many men accused of sexual harassment and sex crimes in the media and on social media who have had no legal action taken against them. It's just too easy in the current social and political climate to ruin someone's reputation or career without producing evidence.
I believe that Mitt Romney and Mike Lee, among others, have jumped the gun on their stance concerning Judge Roy Moore. Innocent until proven guilty must be maintained in all social interactions, not just legal cases. To be tried and convicted in the court of news media and/or social media throws American culture back to the Salem witch trials. And in modern times, accusations that carry the weight of convictions have been a mainstay of communist and other totalitarian regimes. Accusations of sexual abuse are serious stuff, to be sure, but to throw out centuries of social and legal progress is equally serious, if not more so.
I agree with the two Susans. Well said.
Shall we now invite "victims" of every Congress member to come forward with their stories to determine which are worthy to stay and which should step down? And perhaps the timing of victim reports should be limited to the month before elections to make the whole exercise more meaningful.
I think it is far too early to be passing judgment on Roy Moore based on accusations about things that supposedly happened 30-40 years ago. I have no firm opinion yet on the accusations. So far the vast majority of the news coverage has only given the accusers' side of the story. It is sad to see people like Mitt Romney making public statements when we know virtually nothing substantive about the accusers and when most media outlets are ignoring the people who have come forward to vouch for Moore's character at the time and since then. Again, I do not know if the accusations are true or not. I want to hear a lot more information and analysis before making a decision. The timing of these accusations certainly should give us pause about the motivation behind them. The timing does not mean the charges are false, but it is reasonable to wonder why we are just now hearing them, just as Moore is poised to win the Senate seat vacated by Jeff Sessions.
The standards for criminal accountability for an action on which the statute of limitation has run and seeking a seat in the United States Senate are quite different. Every voter (not 12 jurors) decides whether the candidate engaged in inappropriate behavior so many years ago and whether or not he should be elected. The Republicans who call for Roy Moore to drop out believe enough of the victims' stories to want him out of the race. In fact the Republican party would be better served by Moore's election and then refusing to seat him, leaving Governor Ivey to appoint a different Republican to the seat. The judgments were not made "based only on news articles". The best friend familiar with the facts of one of the victims is an LDS woman now living in Utah.
A question for commenters Susan and Susan: if Roy Moore had been a Democrat, honestly, how vigorously would you have made the same argument?
Mitt Romney and Mike Lee, among others, have jumped the gun on their stance concerning Judge Roy Moore. Innocent until proven guilty must be maintained in all social interactions, not just legal cases. To be tried and convicted in the court of news media and/or social media throws American culture back to the Salem witch trials. And in modern times, accusations that carry the weight of convictions have been a mainstay of communist and other totalitarian regimes. Accusations of sexual abuse are serious stuff, to be sure, but to throw out centuries of social and legal progress is equally serious, if not more so.
There's nothing virtuous about swiftly passing judgment about another human being, based only on news articles. We live in an age when it is not uncommon for utterly false accusations to be made in the public square. We Mormons know better than to believe every story on the internet or in print. "Prove all things; hold fast that which is good." The Atlantic "compliment" is purely political, nothing for Mormons to be proud of. Time will tell show the truth. There are more questions than answers, so far.
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