Well written and heartfully expressed. I personally have very strong, and for lack of a better description, very conservative views on the whole LGBTQ+ thing. Personally I believe there is a small, very small percentage that may have some actual biological, chemical, mental reason for their leanings/choices but for the most part it is social conditioning and the influence of Satan who is the master psychologist and deceiver. But, I try to treat everyone including LGBTQ family members and others with courtesy, respect and love.
E PooleSeptember 4, 2021
Thank you for your well thought out account of your journey. It does not sound like it was an easy one, but your willingness to persevere and endure until you found answers is very inspiring. Thank you for your wonderful example and testimony.
T LarsenSeptember 2, 2021
Thank you for this beautiful account of part of your faith journey. As someone whose personal concerns over this issue have been mild by comparison, it is helpful to be reminded that Church member don't just fall into "support the Church's teachings" and "don't support the Church's teachings". There is a lot of room on the spectrum between those positions, and it is the direction our faith is pointing us that matters the most.
Ovala F ToiaivaoSeptember 2, 2021
Wow, what a beautiful testimony of faith! Thank your for sharing this powerful account of your personal experiences wrestling with this heart wrenching topic as a new convert. This very issue is one of the main reason why our family has broken apart as 7 of our 8 children have literally left the church over it. Thanks again for sharing!
vickieSeptember 1, 2021
I am a mother of 5 kids, one girl and four boys. my last child is now a homosexual married to his best friend or another man. i never suspected i would have a child who had this kind of issue. we always think its other people that go through these things. i love all my children. this young man was a good kid, he always did the right thing, and he was great in school and went to college and went on a misison. his brothers and sister noticed things before i ever suspected anything. when he was a little guy he would put a towel on his head and pretend it was long hair. he wanted to immitate his sister. he was very aloof and as he grew older he became a sort of angry young guy. he was gifted with voice and playing the piano and acting. he came out later when he was about 34 and let me know he was engaged. i went to his wedding. i love my son and will always support him. i believe in what the prophets say and the family proclemation. when i first heard my son was gay i nearly went nuts. it was my husband who kept his head and said i love him and he is my son. that woke me up. i reaized thorugh my crying and grief i loved my son so much and the pain i felt was that of worry over what would happen to him. we do read about how others see them and sometimes torture them or they commit suicide. i never spoke to him regarding it but i might send this article to him because being a pc mother here on earth means never confronting him or letting him know what i think about it and that i love him. his mater is a great guy as well. he made his choice and i have no idea as to what to do. he will be or is 36 now. he never contacts me but he was always kind of like that anyway. aloof. i actually dont know what to do. i think he knows what he is doing and what it means. i also wonder if he knows what to do about it or which way to go. he has commited himself to another person. that person i dont think has any belief. my son had a wonderful patriarchal blessing wherein it said that the Lord would have His hand on my sons head. so, now i am praying and wondering. i think his teen anger was over how his brothers would joke abt LGBT issues and people and felt we all felt that way, and we probably did. you dont know what to feel until it is standing on your doorstep. all i know is that i love the Lord and will continue to pray fo rmy son and his mate. i know that there are many moms and dads like me.
LauraSeptember 1, 2021
What a beautiful expression of faith! Your journey shows what it looks like to strive to align our views with God's -- and it takes humility. I hope that those struggling with the same (and other) issues can similarly cling fast to their testimonies as they pray to change their own understanding, not the Lord's.
Randall M SmithSeptember 1, 2021
This is so well written, applicable to every controversial doctrine in the Church. A must read for everyone.
Gordon J HensleySeptember 1, 2021
Even though I don’t have a perfect knowledge of the way things work in the worlds beyond the veil, I can’t help but think that the laws of physics will still apply. Eternal families are created the same way they are here on Earth, with a man and a woman providing a physical body for a spirit child. In an eternal world where there is no war, death, adultery, broken marriages, or poverty, and therefore no orphaned children, where would a functionally sterile celestial couple go to find children to “adopt” into a celestial family? There will undoubtedly be many good people participating in long term friendships and relationships in the lesser kingdoms, but unless you follow the commandments and complete the ordinances that “unlock the bonus level” of the Celestial Kingdom, you won’t be able to enjoy the full work and glory of eternal life.
JosephSeptember 1, 2021
Thank you Daniel for such detailed and very well written account on your efforts and patience during your personal search for the truth on this polemic issue. May The Lord continue blessing your life with the kind of light you deserve to keep your faith healthy and strong.
Jo Ann OkelberrySeptember 1, 2021
I am so grateful that you have taken the time to write this beautiful article. You have given us a great lesson on how to deal with things that disappoint or anger us. I am so glad that we have our Heavenly Father who welcomes us and our prayers and gives us peace.
MakeliSeptember 1, 2021
Thank you for this thoughtful and vunerable account of your conversion. What a beautiful sentiment to choose humility first. I can tell you're a good guy. Thank you.
Pat StreeperSeptember 1, 2021
Thank you for your beautiful testimony!
SaraSeptember 1, 2021
I don’t think you give yourself enough credit for the effort you put forth to come to the conclusion that you have. You were humble enough to realize that your views may not be correct, even though you held them close. You did exactly as we are counseled to do both in scripture and by Church leaders, and that is the most inspiring part of this whole story to me. Thank you for sharing it.
Ruth JamiesonSeptember 1, 2021
Your story is a wonderful journey of faith and perseverance. Thank you for your example of hope.
Sasha KwapinskiSeptember 1, 2021
As one who was personally involved in California's Proposition 8 campaign (and contributed some of the money behind it) I welcome and support the church leaders' efforts to be inclusive, loving, and supportive toward LGBT members as children of God. I try to practice these principles in my own behavior and relationships.
At the same time, I appreciate being a member of a denomination which recognizes the distinction between love and relativism. Marriage is ultimately a moral construct with a moral definition, or it essentially becomes a non-construct with no definition -- just a matter of random lifestyle choices or the latest public opinion poll.
Bob TaylorSeptember 1, 2021
thank you for sharing your story.
i tried to pm you, but the link was not working for me - a question, if you don't mind sharing. many years ago, i had a classmate in elementary school whose name was Jim Ortner (La Jolla, CA) - any relation?
EveSeptember 1, 2021
I'm so impressed with your story. We all struggle with pride, but you were able to stay humble and open to revelation. What a wonderful example! Thank you!
Dennis HorneSeptember 1, 2021
Sometimes the Lord has to (figuratively) pull people kicking and screaming out of the philosophies of the world/society, into the light of the gospel and the scriptures/teachings of prophets. Anyone imbued with modern societies views could have various amounts of trouble making the transition.
It used to be that the world and the church weren't that far off in many things, including morality. Now that is no longer the case at all. There is a divide people must cross to become fully converted and fully sustain the Brethren.
PamSeptember 1, 2021
Thank you for sharing your experiences. I hope they help others who are struggling.
Rochelle HaleSeptember 1, 2021
Thank you for sharing your journey and testimony. The problem with the worldview is that it wants to contradict God. Rather than being hateful or less tolerant, Latter-Day Saints should even more greatly express love to those whom we know to be our spiritual brothers and sisters. We all chose the plan to be here. Nevertheless, the Lord has given his counsel. A friend of another faith once questioned me about the Word of Wisdom. Her response was, "Why would God care what we eat, etc.?" As a loving Heavenly Father, why would he not???!!!! We do not worship a vengeful God, but one who loves us more than we can possibly know and wants to bless all of His children.
K RoundySeptember 1, 2021
I love this. I agree that "we are NOT on the wrong side of history, because we are on the Lord's side"; and He cannot be coerced, threatened, or convinced to change his mind on the matter.
PennieSeptember 1, 2021
I fully support Elder Holland. If the apostles and prophets bend to social pressure, we will be lost. I feel very secure knowing that they will stand up to the secular teachings of our day. Each member of this church is going to have to decide where they stand and with whom they stand. I stand with the First Presidency and the Twelve. God never gave a commandment that was not for our eternal benefit. I believe firmly that there is no gayness in eternity. It's a mortal challenge
AnonymousSeptember 1, 2021
Daniel, thank you for this beautiful account. I appreciate your testimony and your personal experiences that have doubtlessly prepared you to write about this topic.
Chuck DeWittSeptember 1, 2021
I am so grateful that I was willing to question my presumptions, pray to God in faith, wrestle with my concern, and ultimately be transformed by the spirit.
This sentence shows the way to truth. Love your story and never forgetting the original testimony from Heaven.
Duane BoyceSeptember 1, 2021
Excellent. Thank you for sharing your experience. Wonderful in every way.
MistySeptember 1, 2021
Thank you for sharing your experience of wrestling with questions and doubts about some of the Church’s teachings. I don’t think there are enough stories out there like this and so many are left with the misconception that everyone is fine with everything or perhaps everyone is just a blind sheep. I hope more stories like this will help others realize it’s ok (as the Brethren have continually taught) to have questions and concerns! But as Brother Holland has also taught, “doubt your doubts” before doubting your testimony.
Harold RustSeptember 1, 2021
Thanks for this personal journey you were willing to share. For some of us who have been members all our lives, the Family Proclamation seemed so obvious we weren't sure why the Church leadership had felt the need to have it published and highlighted. Little did we realize that within just a decade there would be a significant numbers of Americans (and others outside the U.S.) who would push against the fundamentals and then gradually become very dogmatic in their rejection of what had been a "non-issue" for several centuries. To me the proclamation was a statement of love and positive confirmation about the purpose of life. Just as we are taught to be "Christ-like" toward those not members of the Church, likewise the Church's message has always been to be respective and loving toward those who may not believe as we do or want to live according to the declarations in the Family Proclamation. That becomes more difficult when those "on the other side" become very public in their accusations and very violently vocal in their attacks on our beliefs. Thus, I feel those who don't agree with Elder Holland should at least follow his approach in how to disagree....through thoughtful and non-contentious discussion meant to share deeply-held feelings in a kind and loving way.
Annie JensenSeptember 1, 2021
Thank you for your thoughtful remarks and for sharing your persistent search for truth.
Comments | Return to Story
Corey D.September 5, 2021
Well written and heartfully expressed. I personally have very strong, and for lack of a better description, very conservative views on the whole LGBTQ+ thing. Personally I believe there is a small, very small percentage that may have some actual biological, chemical, mental reason for their leanings/choices but for the most part it is social conditioning and the influence of Satan who is the master psychologist and deceiver. But, I try to treat everyone including LGBTQ family members and others with courtesy, respect and love.
E PooleSeptember 4, 2021
Thank you for your well thought out account of your journey. It does not sound like it was an easy one, but your willingness to persevere and endure until you found answers is very inspiring. Thank you for your wonderful example and testimony.
T LarsenSeptember 2, 2021
Thank you for this beautiful account of part of your faith journey. As someone whose personal concerns over this issue have been mild by comparison, it is helpful to be reminded that Church member don't just fall into "support the Church's teachings" and "don't support the Church's teachings". There is a lot of room on the spectrum between those positions, and it is the direction our faith is pointing us that matters the most.
Ovala F ToiaivaoSeptember 2, 2021
Wow, what a beautiful testimony of faith! Thank your for sharing this powerful account of your personal experiences wrestling with this heart wrenching topic as a new convert. This very issue is one of the main reason why our family has broken apart as 7 of our 8 children have literally left the church over it. Thanks again for sharing!
vickieSeptember 1, 2021
I am a mother of 5 kids, one girl and four boys. my last child is now a homosexual married to his best friend or another man. i never suspected i would have a child who had this kind of issue. we always think its other people that go through these things. i love all my children. this young man was a good kid, he always did the right thing, and he was great in school and went to college and went on a misison. his brothers and sister noticed things before i ever suspected anything. when he was a little guy he would put a towel on his head and pretend it was long hair. he wanted to immitate his sister. he was very aloof and as he grew older he became a sort of angry young guy. he was gifted with voice and playing the piano and acting. he came out later when he was about 34 and let me know he was engaged. i went to his wedding. i love my son and will always support him. i believe in what the prophets say and the family proclemation. when i first heard my son was gay i nearly went nuts. it was my husband who kept his head and said i love him and he is my son. that woke me up. i reaized thorugh my crying and grief i loved my son so much and the pain i felt was that of worry over what would happen to him. we do read about how others see them and sometimes torture them or they commit suicide. i never spoke to him regarding it but i might send this article to him because being a pc mother here on earth means never confronting him or letting him know what i think about it and that i love him. his mater is a great guy as well. he made his choice and i have no idea as to what to do. he will be or is 36 now. he never contacts me but he was always kind of like that anyway. aloof. i actually dont know what to do. i think he knows what he is doing and what it means. i also wonder if he knows what to do about it or which way to go. he has commited himself to another person. that person i dont think has any belief. my son had a wonderful patriarchal blessing wherein it said that the Lord would have His hand on my sons head. so, now i am praying and wondering. i think his teen anger was over how his brothers would joke abt LGBT issues and people and felt we all felt that way, and we probably did. you dont know what to feel until it is standing on your doorstep. all i know is that i love the Lord and will continue to pray fo rmy son and his mate. i know that there are many moms and dads like me.
LauraSeptember 1, 2021
What a beautiful expression of faith! Your journey shows what it looks like to strive to align our views with God's -- and it takes humility. I hope that those struggling with the same (and other) issues can similarly cling fast to their testimonies as they pray to change their own understanding, not the Lord's.
Randall M SmithSeptember 1, 2021
This is so well written, applicable to every controversial doctrine in the Church. A must read for everyone.
Gordon J HensleySeptember 1, 2021
Even though I don’t have a perfect knowledge of the way things work in the worlds beyond the veil, I can’t help but think that the laws of physics will still apply. Eternal families are created the same way they are here on Earth, with a man and a woman providing a physical body for a spirit child. In an eternal world where there is no war, death, adultery, broken marriages, or poverty, and therefore no orphaned children, where would a functionally sterile celestial couple go to find children to “adopt” into a celestial family? There will undoubtedly be many good people participating in long term friendships and relationships in the lesser kingdoms, but unless you follow the commandments and complete the ordinances that “unlock the bonus level” of the Celestial Kingdom, you won’t be able to enjoy the full work and glory of eternal life.
JosephSeptember 1, 2021
Thank you Daniel for such detailed and very well written account on your efforts and patience during your personal search for the truth on this polemic issue. May The Lord continue blessing your life with the kind of light you deserve to keep your faith healthy and strong.
Jo Ann OkelberrySeptember 1, 2021
I am so grateful that you have taken the time to write this beautiful article. You have given us a great lesson on how to deal with things that disappoint or anger us. I am so glad that we have our Heavenly Father who welcomes us and our prayers and gives us peace.
MakeliSeptember 1, 2021
Thank you for this thoughtful and vunerable account of your conversion. What a beautiful sentiment to choose humility first. I can tell you're a good guy. Thank you.
Pat StreeperSeptember 1, 2021
Thank you for your beautiful testimony!
SaraSeptember 1, 2021
I don’t think you give yourself enough credit for the effort you put forth to come to the conclusion that you have. You were humble enough to realize that your views may not be correct, even though you held them close. You did exactly as we are counseled to do both in scripture and by Church leaders, and that is the most inspiring part of this whole story to me. Thank you for sharing it.
Ruth JamiesonSeptember 1, 2021
Your story is a wonderful journey of faith and perseverance. Thank you for your example of hope.
Sasha KwapinskiSeptember 1, 2021
As one who was personally involved in California's Proposition 8 campaign (and contributed some of the money behind it) I welcome and support the church leaders' efforts to be inclusive, loving, and supportive toward LGBT members as children of God. I try to practice these principles in my own behavior and relationships. At the same time, I appreciate being a member of a denomination which recognizes the distinction between love and relativism. Marriage is ultimately a moral construct with a moral definition, or it essentially becomes a non-construct with no definition -- just a matter of random lifestyle choices or the latest public opinion poll.
Bob TaylorSeptember 1, 2021
thank you for sharing your story. i tried to pm you, but the link was not working for me - a question, if you don't mind sharing. many years ago, i had a classmate in elementary school whose name was Jim Ortner (La Jolla, CA) - any relation?
EveSeptember 1, 2021
I'm so impressed with your story. We all struggle with pride, but you were able to stay humble and open to revelation. What a wonderful example! Thank you!
Dennis HorneSeptember 1, 2021
Sometimes the Lord has to (figuratively) pull people kicking and screaming out of the philosophies of the world/society, into the light of the gospel and the scriptures/teachings of prophets. Anyone imbued with modern societies views could have various amounts of trouble making the transition. It used to be that the world and the church weren't that far off in many things, including morality. Now that is no longer the case at all. There is a divide people must cross to become fully converted and fully sustain the Brethren.
PamSeptember 1, 2021
Thank you for sharing your experiences. I hope they help others who are struggling.
Rochelle HaleSeptember 1, 2021
Thank you for sharing your journey and testimony. The problem with the worldview is that it wants to contradict God. Rather than being hateful or less tolerant, Latter-Day Saints should even more greatly express love to those whom we know to be our spiritual brothers and sisters. We all chose the plan to be here. Nevertheless, the Lord has given his counsel. A friend of another faith once questioned me about the Word of Wisdom. Her response was, "Why would God care what we eat, etc.?" As a loving Heavenly Father, why would he not???!!!! We do not worship a vengeful God, but one who loves us more than we can possibly know and wants to bless all of His children.
K RoundySeptember 1, 2021
I love this. I agree that "we are NOT on the wrong side of history, because we are on the Lord's side"; and He cannot be coerced, threatened, or convinced to change his mind on the matter.
PennieSeptember 1, 2021
I fully support Elder Holland. If the apostles and prophets bend to social pressure, we will be lost. I feel very secure knowing that they will stand up to the secular teachings of our day. Each member of this church is going to have to decide where they stand and with whom they stand. I stand with the First Presidency and the Twelve. God never gave a commandment that was not for our eternal benefit. I believe firmly that there is no gayness in eternity. It's a mortal challenge
AnonymousSeptember 1, 2021
Daniel, thank you for this beautiful account. I appreciate your testimony and your personal experiences that have doubtlessly prepared you to write about this topic.
Chuck DeWittSeptember 1, 2021
I am so grateful that I was willing to question my presumptions, pray to God in faith, wrestle with my concern, and ultimately be transformed by the spirit. This sentence shows the way to truth. Love your story and never forgetting the original testimony from Heaven.
Duane BoyceSeptember 1, 2021
Excellent. Thank you for sharing your experience. Wonderful in every way.
MistySeptember 1, 2021
Thank you for sharing your experience of wrestling with questions and doubts about some of the Church’s teachings. I don’t think there are enough stories out there like this and so many are left with the misconception that everyone is fine with everything or perhaps everyone is just a blind sheep. I hope more stories like this will help others realize it’s ok (as the Brethren have continually taught) to have questions and concerns! But as Brother Holland has also taught, “doubt your doubts” before doubting your testimony.
Harold RustSeptember 1, 2021
Thanks for this personal journey you were willing to share. For some of us who have been members all our lives, the Family Proclamation seemed so obvious we weren't sure why the Church leadership had felt the need to have it published and highlighted. Little did we realize that within just a decade there would be a significant numbers of Americans (and others outside the U.S.) who would push against the fundamentals and then gradually become very dogmatic in their rejection of what had been a "non-issue" for several centuries. To me the proclamation was a statement of love and positive confirmation about the purpose of life. Just as we are taught to be "Christ-like" toward those not members of the Church, likewise the Church's message has always been to be respective and loving toward those who may not believe as we do or want to live according to the declarations in the Family Proclamation. That becomes more difficult when those "on the other side" become very public in their accusations and very violently vocal in their attacks on our beliefs. Thus, I feel those who don't agree with Elder Holland should at least follow his approach in how to disagree....through thoughtful and non-contentious discussion meant to share deeply-held feelings in a kind and loving way.
Annie JensenSeptember 1, 2021
Thank you for your thoughtful remarks and for sharing your persistent search for truth.
ADD A COMMENT