Do we know every scripture that Moroni told Joseph Smith on his September 21 visit in 1823? Our first answer is, “They are listed right here in Joseph Smith’s history.” Yet Oliver Cowdery told us there are many more. And here’s another surprise—all but two are from the Old Testament.
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Do we know every scripture that Moroni told Joseph Smith on his September 21 visit in 1823? Our first answer is, “They are listed right here in Joseph Smith’s history.” Yet Oliver Cowdery told us there are many more. And here’s another surprise—all but two are from the Old Testament.
Hello, we are Scot and Maurine Proctor and this is Meridian Magazine’s Come Follow Me podcast. Today we will be studying Doctrine and Covenants Section 2 and Joseph Smith-History 1, verses 27-65 for a lesson titled, “The Hearts of the Children Shall Turn to Their Fathers.” Would you tell your family and friends about this podcast or put it on Facebook? We would love that. The podcasts and the transcripts can be found at latterdaysaintmag.com/podcast. That mag is m-a-g as in magazine. So that’s latterdaysaintmag.com/podcast.
Hugh Nibley asks a searching question:
After his First Vision, why were people so furiously angry with Joseph Smith? It was not for being a reformer or rebuking a naughty world. In his day, the most popular preacher was the one who could denounce the manners of the times most fiercely and paint the most lurid pictures of wrath to come. Nobody led militant campaigns against even the most rabid preachers of hellfire or swore to drink their blood…the country was full of strange separatist cults with strange social programs and strange moral practices such as the Mormons were falsely accused of, but no one thought it virtuous to burn their settlements or shoot them on sight. In what did the modern prophet’s deadly offense consist?”
Nibley said, “Joseph, as so many of the Prophets of old, said, “I had seen a light, and in that light I saw two personages who did in reality speak to me.” As soon as he said this to the world, all hell broke loose. That changed everything. And so he testified throughout his life. And so it was for him. “Though I was hated and persecuted for saying that I had seen a vision, yet it was true; and while they were persecuting me, reviling me, and speaking all manner of evil against me falsely for so saying, I was led to say in my heart: Why persecute me for telling the truth? I have actually seen a vision; and who am I that I can withstand God, or why does the world think to make me deny what I have actually seen? For I had seen a vision; I knew it, and I knew that God knew it, and I could not deny it.” (Joseph Smith History, 1: 25)
You would think a boy of 14 who said he had a vision would be ignored in his youth, dismissed as inconsequential. That his experience should cause such a ruckus reminds us that Satan knew who this young Joseph really was and would never let him rest. From the First Vision, through those tender growing up times of adolescence, he was “all the time suffering severe persecution at the hands of all classes of men, both religious and irreligious, because I continued to affirm that I had seen a vision” and then there is this poignant phrase, “persecuted by those who ought to have been my friends and to have treated me kindly” (Joseph Smith History-1: 27,28).
So, he comes to the night of Sept. 21, 1823, and he has on his mind, the same thing he did when he had the First Vision, which is the state of his soul. Could his sins be forgiven him? He says that he had been “led…into divers temptations, offensive in the sight of God” Joseph Smith History-1: 28), and by this he meant nothing serious but the levity and the foolish errors of youth.
As he is seeking the assurance that he is still acceptable in the eyes of the Lord, he makes a striking statement. “I had full bconfidence in obtaining a divine manifestation, as I previously had one.” (Joseph Smith History 1:29). Now, this is from a young man who was just three months shy of 18 years old.
Our experiences with God grow our faith and prepare us for more. When you have seen a prayer answered or felt His stirrings in your soul, you have a growing evidence that God responds to you. That is why opening your eyes to see the Lord’s hand in your life and then writing down those moments, large or small is so important. These prepare you to move forward into an even deeper relationship with God.
We have a friend whose sister is in critical condition in the hospital, who wrote this week on Facebook, “Sometimes we find ourselves praying for a Parting-of-the-Red-Sea kind of miracle and fail to see a multitude of other tender mercies if that’s not the miracle we get.”
God’s manifestations to us are all around if we have the eyes to see, and seeing prepares us with faith for more. Joseph Smith had full confidence he would receive a divine manifestation this night.
Oliver Cowdery describes what Joseph’s prayer that night that Moroni first came. Oliver writes, “On the evening of the 21st of September, 1823, previous to retiring to rest, our brother’s mind was unusually wrought up on the subject which had so long agitated his mind—his heart was drawn out in fervent prayer, and his whole soul was so lost to everything of a temporal nature that earth to him had lost its charms, and all he desired was to be prepared in heart to commune with some kind messenger who could communicate to him the desired information of his acceptance with God.
“At length,” he says, “the family retired, and he, as usual, bent his way, though in silence, where others might have rested their weary frames ‘locked fast in sleep’s embrace,’ but repose had fled, and accustomed slumber had spread her refreshing hand over others beside him—he continued still to pray—his heart, though once hard and obdurate, was softened, and that mind which had often flitted, like the ‘wild bird of passage,’ had settled upon a determined basis not to be decoyed or driven from its purpose.” Citation in original: “Oliver Cowdery, ‘A Remarkable Vision,’ Latter-day Saints’ Millennial Star 1, no. 2 (May 1840–April 1841): 42.” Originally published in Latter Day Saints’ Messenger and Advocate 1, no. 5 (Feb. 1835): 78–79.
I love that image of our thoughts as a “wild bird of passage.” How often they are! And how often we wish they were not that way.
When I think of a wild bird of passage, I remember the day that a bird flew into our office through an open window. It could not find its way out, and in its panic it flew from one side of the room to the other in useless flutterings. We watched it swoop from corner to corner, dashing about and making no progress. That sort of panic is in great contrast to Joseph’s determined prayer that would not be decoyed or driven from its purpose.
Then a light began to appear in Joseph’s room which continued to increase until the room was lighter than at noonday. We have sometimes seen paintings of Joseph being alone in this room, but remember, this is a pioneer cabin, and his brothers are also there packed into the beds. They did not see what Joseph saw, because this message was not for them.
Joseph’s attempts to describe Moroni are inadequate because we don’t have the mortal words for heavenly things. Joseph said the whiteness of his robe “was beyond anything earthly I had ever seen; nor do I believe that any earthly thing could be made to appear so exceedingly white and brilliant…His whole person was glorious beyond description, and his countenance truly like lightening” (Joseph Smith—History 1: 31,32).
Our language here on earth is wholly unable to describe the heavenly. Joseph was, at first, afraid, but as in the First Vision, the first word he heard was a comforting one—his own name. He was known in the heavens and one had come from the presence of God to deliver a message that was particularly for him.
He was told that God had a work for him to do, but he was also warned as he says, that my name should be had for good and evil among all nations, kindreds, and tongues, or that it should be both good and evil spoken of among all people.
This is a prophecy that continues to be fulfilled.
Let’s get a picture of Joseph in our minds. Parley P. Pratt described him: “There was something connected with the serene and steady penetrating glance of his eye, as if he would penetrate the deepest abyss of the human heart, gaze into eternity, penetrate the heavens, and comprehend all worlds.
“He possessed a noble boldness and independence of character; his manner was easy and familiar; his rebuke terrible as the lion; his benevolence unbounded as the ocean; his intelligence universal, and his language abounding in original eloquence peculiar to himself—not polished—not studied—not smoothed and softened by education and refined by art; but flowing forth in its own native simplicity, and profusely abounding in variety of subject and manner. He interested and edified, while, at the same time, he amused and entertained his audience; and none listened to him that were ever weary with his discourse. I have even known him to retain a congregation of willing and anxious listeners for many hours together, in the midst of cold or sunshine, rain or wind, while they were laughing at one moment and weeping the next. Even his most bitter enemies were generally overcome, if he could once get their ears.” (from The Autobiogrqphy of Parley P. Pratt)
Believers and those whose attention he could capture loved Joseph Smith and do so to this day, but detractors have during his life and to this day reviled him, accused him, traduced him, disdained him, belittled him, mocked him and beaten him up in the court of public opinion. Many who leave the church will say, “It is that Joseph Smith that I just can’t handle.”
Who was this angel who had entered his room? Of course, Moroni, who had cared meticulously for the plates through 36 years of wandering, until he could bury them in a hill in Manchester New York, not very far from where a young prophet would come to live 1400 years later.
The Lord tells us what Moroni’s specific mission is in Doctrine and Covenants 27:5, “I have sent [Moroni] unto you to reveal the Book of Mormon, containing the fulness of my everlasting gospel, to whom I have committed the keys of the stick of Ephraim.”
That really is an exciting thing to know that Moroni actually holds the priesthood keys of the stick of Ephraim (which includes what has been published and what will yet be published some day from the sealed portion). Moroni gave a lengthy and profound message to Joseph, and when he was finished, Joseph “saw the light in the room begin to gather immediately around the person of him who had been speaking to me, and it continued to do so until the room was again left dark, except just around him; when, instantly I saw, as it were, a conduit open right up into heaven, and he aascended till he entirely disappeared, and the room was left as it had been before this heavenly light had made its appearance.”
He said, “I lay musing on the singularity of the scene, and marveling greatly at what had been told to me by this extraordinary messenger; when, in the midst of my meditation, I suddenly discovered that my room was again beginning to get lighted, and in an instant, as it were, the same heavenly messenger was again by my bedside” (Joseph Smith—History 1: 43,44).
Moroni came three times, repeating without variation what he said, and then adding words of warning. These visits took the entire night, until the cock crowed, indicating morning. We will look at what Moroni taught in two parts, first about obtaining the plates.
Moroni told him that not far away, a record containing the fulness of the everlasting gospel, was buried in a hill on the west side, not far from the top. The plates were deposited in a stone box and “this stone was thick and rounding in the middle on the upper side, and thinner towards the edges, so that the middle part of it was visible above the ground, but the edge all around was covered with earth.” In the box was also the urim and thummim, and the breastplate, so the record could be translated.
This was clearly not just described to Joseph, but shown in vision, because he recognized the place as soon as he saw it. In addition to what the Joseph Smith’s History tells us about what happened next, here is Lucy Mack Smith’s description of the events of the next day.
“The next day Joseph, his father, and his brother Alvin were reaping in the field together. Suddenly, Joseph stopped and seemed to be in a deep study for some time. Alvin hurried him, saying, “Joseph, you must keep to work or we shall not get our task done.” Joseph worked again diligently, then stopped in the same way a second time. When his father saw that Joseph was very pale, he urged him to go to the house and tell his mother that he was sick. He went a short distance till he came to a beautiful green under an apple tree. Here he lay down on his face, for he was so weak he could go no farther.
“He was here but a short time, when the messenger whom he had seen the night before came to him again and said, ‘Why did you not tell your father what I told you?’ Joseph said he was afraid his father would not believe him. ‘He will believe every word you say to him,’ said the angel.”
This is an important point. We’ve said how Joseph had been persecuted since his First Vision, and now he will be adding translating ancient gold plates to the reasons for disdain. What he did have was a loyal, supportive, unwavering family, who would believe him, who would stand by him in every hardship, who would buoy and sustain him, and would take this project as their own.
Lucy continued, “Joseph then promised to do as he was told by the angel and rose up and returned to the field, where he had left my husband and Alvin; but when he got there, his father had just gone to the house, as he was somewhat unwell. Joseph then requested Alvin to go to the house and ask his father to the field, for, said he, I have something to tell him.’ When his father came to him, Joseph rehearsed all that had passed between him and the angel the previous night. Having heard this account, his father charged him not to fail in attending strictly to the instruction which he had received from this heavenly messenger.”
Moroni had told Joseph “that Satan would try to btempt me (in consequence of the indigent circumstances of my father’s family), to get the plates for the purpose of getting crich. This he forbade me, saying that I must have no other object in view in getting the plates but to glorify God, and must not be influenced by any other dmotive than that of building his kingdom; otherwise I could not get them (Joseph Smith—History 1: 46).
Joseph then left and went to the hill, which was two to three miles distant. Joseph told Oliver Cowdery later that “it seemed as though two invisible powers were influencing, or striving to influence his mind.” One urged him to get the record and treat it as he had been commanded, seeking the glory of God. The other influence urged him to get the record to make himself wealthy and important. The instruction he had received, to ‘pray always—which was expressly impressed upon him, was at length entirely forgotten, and … a fixed determination to obtain [the plates] and aggrandize himself, occupied his mind when he arrived at the place where the record was found.’”
Joseph pried open the lid of the box and tried three times to take the plates, but each time received a progressively stronger shock, and finally cried out, “Why can I not obtain this book?”
Moroni appeared to him again, now the fifth time in 24 hours. Oliver said, ““In an instant,” Oliver recorded, “all the former instructions, the great intelligence concerning Israel and the last days, were brought to his mind, … but he had failed to remember the great end for which [the gold plates] had been kept, and in consequence could not have power to take them into his possession and bear them away.” (Latter Day Saints’ Messenger and Advocate, Oct. 1835, pp. 197–98.)
As Joseph prayed, that confusion of darkness that had shadowed his spirit was dispelled, and he was filled with the Holy Ghost. Two thoughts occur from this. First, just as in the First Vision, Satan tried in every way to attack Joseph and thwart this work, and he would ever be at Joseph’s heels—and still is in our day (attacking the Prophet Joseph)–and second, Satan works upon our minds with confusion, and sudden discouraging thoughts that undermine faith and purpose. When you feel a swirl of heaviness upon you, you can know that the Adversary is probably working upon you.
As Joseph prayed a vision of the starkest contrasts came upon him. At first, the heavens were opened and as Oliver Cowdery’s account says, “Joseph stood gazing and admiring,” until the scene was abruptly changed and Joseph “beheld the prince of darkness, surrounded by his innumerable train of associates.” (Latter Day Saints’ Messenger and Advocate, Oct. 1835, pp. 197–98, also see H. Donl Peterson, “Moroni—Joseph Smith’s Tutor https://www.churchofjesuschrist.org/study/ensign/1992/01/moroni-joseph-smiths-tutor?lang=eng )
Moroni explained, “All this is shown, the good and the evil, the holy and impure, the glory of God and the power of darkness, that you may know hereafter the two powers and never be influenced or overcome by that wicked one. Behold, whatever entices and leads to good and to do good, is of God, and whatever does not is of that wicked one: It is he that fills the hearts of men with evil, to walk in darkness and blaspheme God; and you may learn from henceforth, that his ways are to destruction, but the way of holiness is peace and rest.” (Ibid., p. 198.)
Lucy Mack Smith added these details to the story, “While Joseph remained here, the angel told him, “Now I will show you the distance between light and darkness, and the operation of a good spirit and an evil one. An evil spirit will try to crowd your mind with every evil and wicked thing to keep every good thought and feeling out of your mind, but you must keep your mind always staid upon God, that no evil may come into your heart.”
She continued, “The angel showed him, by contrast, the difference between good and evil, and likewise the consequences of both obedience and disobedience to the commandments of God, in such a striking manner, that the impression was always vivid in his memory until the very end of his days; and in giving a relation of this circumstance, not long prior to his death, he remarked that ever afterwards he was willing to keep the commandments of God.
“Furthermore, the angel told him at the interview mentioned last that the time had not yet come for the plates to be brought forth to the world; that he could not take them from the place wherein they were deposited until he had learned to keep the commandments of God-not only till he was willing, but able to do it. The angel bade Joseph come to this place every year, at the same time of the year, and he would meet him there and give him further instructions.”
I find the statement intriguing, he had to be ready not just by being willing to keep the commandments, but able to do so. Ours is a gospel of development, and while we may give our nod to the commandments and even be thrilled by their beauty and promise, living the commandments means transformation and steady growth. This does not happen in a stroke, neither does the Lord gesture your way, and of a sudden you are a new person. He has us on a course of development and sometimes it is very hard. You have to trust in the process.
So Moroni would be Joseph’s mentor and teacher and friend in the heavy responsibility he was given.
Lucy said, “When Joseph came in that evening after he had first seen the plates, he told the whole family all that he had made known to his father in the field and also of finding the record, as well as what passed between him and the angel while he was at the place where the plates were deposited.
“We sat up very late and listened attentively to all that he had to say to us, but his mind had been so exercised that he became very much fatigued. When Alvin saw this he said, ‘Now, brother, let us go to bed. We will get up early in the morning and go to work so as to finish our day’s labor by an hour before sunset, and if Mother will get our suppers early, we will then have a fine, long evening and all sit down and hear you talk.’”
Lucy continued, “The next day we worked with great ambition and were ready by sunset to give our whole attention to the discourse of my son, pertaining to the obtaining of the plates, the goodness of God, his knowledge and power, our own liability to error and transgression, and the great salvation that lay before the faithful. “Now,” said he, ‘Father and Mother, the angel of the Lord says that we must be careful not to proclaim these things or to mention them abroad, for we do not any of us know the weakness of the world, which is so sinful, and that when we get the plates they will want to kill us for the sake of the gold, if they know we have them. And as soon as they do find that we pretend to have any such thing, our names will be cast out as evil, and we shall be scoffed at and all names of evil spoken concerning us.’
Moroni tutored Joseph. We know of at least 22 visits he made to the prophet, but we don’t begin to understand all he was taught.
Lucy said, “From this time forth Joseph continued to receive instructions from time to time, and every evening we gathered our children together and gave our time up to the discussion of those things which he instructed to us. I think that we presented the most peculiar aspect of any family that ever lived upon the earth, all seated in a circle, father, mother, sons, and daughters, listening in breathless anxiety to the religious teachings of a boy eighteen years of age who had never read the Bible through by course in his life. For Joseph was less inclined to the study of books than any child we had, but much more given to reflection and deep study…
So every year on the same date, Sept. 22, right, incidentally, at the fall equinox, Joseph returned to the hill to receive instructions from Moroni. This means that starting in 1823, and each year following until 1827, when he was finally able to obtain the plates, Joseph received extensive instructions.
To get a small sense of it, here is what Lucy said, “In the course of our evening conversations, Joseph gave us some of the most amusing recitals which could be imagined. He would describe the ancient inhabitants of this continent, their dress, their manner of traveling, the animals which they rode, the cities that they built, and the structure of their buildings with every particular, their mode of warfare, and their religious worship as specifically as though he had spent his life with them.”
In the second part of Moroni’s visit, he quoted a series of scriptures to Joseph, but we learn from Oliver that these were accompanied by visions that were far-reaching and transcendent about what has been and what will be, and what role Joseph Smith was called to play.
When I was young, wanting to understand Moroni’s visit better, I typed out all the scriptures from Joseph Smith—History that were mentioned and added little pieces about what Joseph said Moroni told him—and then I read it aloud and timed it. It came to 17-1/2 minutes. Three times that was only about 52-1/2 minutes. Clearly this would not have taken all the night, and just as clearly, Joseph Smith had not told us all. At the end of verse 41 in the Joseph Smith History account he records: “He quoted many other passages of scripture, and offered many explanations which cannot be mentioned here.” There’s 16 more words that have nearly driven me mad.
But, while Joseph Smith gives us five scriptural passages, we’re grateful that Oliver Cowdery points to another thirty, in a series of three letters given February, April and July of 1835 in The Messenger and Advocate.” We have no particular reason to doubt that Oliver heard this first-hand from Joseph. For a list of these additional scriptures, see the transcript of this podcast at latterdaysaintmag.com/podcast, but they include two passages from Deuteronomy, five from the Psalms, 10 from Isaiah, 9 from Jeremiah, 1 from Joel, 2 from Malachi. [Deut. 32: 23-24; Deut. 32:43; Ps. 100: 1-2; Psalms 107,1-7; Psalms 144: 11-12; Psalms 144:13; Psalms 146: 10; Isa 1:7; Isa. 1: 23-25; Isa. 25-26; Isa. 2:1-4; Isa. 4: 4-5; Isa. 11: 1-16; Isa. 20:11; Isa. 29:13; Isa. 29: 14; Isa. 43:6; Jer. 16:16; Jer. 30: 18-31; Jer. 31:1; Jer. 31:6; Jer. 31:9; Jer. 31:27-28; Jer.31: 32-33; Jer. 50: 4-5; Jer. 2: 28-32; Joel 2:28-32; Mal. 3: 1-4; Mal. 4: 1-6; Acts 3: 22-23; 1 Cor. 27-28)
In Joseph’s lifetime, he wrote or dictated four separate accounts of the appearance of Moroni. In the 1842 Wentworth Letter, Joseph Smith wrote that Moroni taught him “that the covenant which God made with ancient Israel was at hand to be fulfilled, that the preparatory work for the second coming of the Messiah was speedily to commence; that the time was at hand for the gospel, in all its fulness to be preached in power, unto all nations that a people might be prepared for the millennial reign.” Moreover, he wrote, “I was informed that I was chosen to be an instrument in the hands of God to bring about some of his purposes in this glorious dispensation.”
Kent P. Jackson wrote, “Although Joseph Smith’s prayer as he went to bed that autumn night was for “a manifestation” to know of his “state and standing” before the Lord (JS—H 1:29), what he received, in addition to that, was a powerful lesson about the mission of God’s people in the dispensation of the fulness of times. Moroni’s message to the young Prophet outlined not only the calling of Joseph Smith, but also the destiny of the Church and kingdom of God from the time of the Restoration until the Millennium.”
Brother Jackson continued, “Significantly, the Lord’s messenger taught these truths by quoting passages out of the Bible. Since the resurrected Christ also taught by quoting and expounding scripture during his appearance to the children of Lehi in the Americas (see 3 Ne. 22–25), we can view this method of teaching as a significant model to be followed in gospel instruction.
“From the scriptures cited by the Prophet in Joseph Smith—History, we can see that Moroni did not select random passages to outline the future of the Lord’s kingdom. They were chosen specifically to introduce the Prophet to his work. “
They were also chosen to demonstrate the continuity of the covenant from the beginning of time.
So here are the major themes:
- The apostasy and scattering. We see it in words like these from Isaiah 1:7 “Your country is desolate, your cities are burned with fire, your land, strangers devour it in your presence…”
- The calling of the prophet Joseph Smith in words like these from Mal. 3:1 “Behold, I will send my messenger and he shall prepare the way before me”.
- The opening of the heavens during the restoration from Joel 2: 28, 29. “And it shall come to pass afterward, that I will pour out my spirit upon all flesh; and your sons and your daughters shall prophesy, your old men shall dream dreams, your young men shall see visions:
“And also upon the servants and upon the handmaids in those days will I pour out my spirit.”
4. The coming forth of the Book of Mormon in words like these from Isaiah 29:14: “I will proceed to do a marvelous work among this people, even a marvelous work and a wonder: for the wisdom of their wise men shall perish, and the understanding of their prudent shall be hid.
5. The restoration of the priesthood and the sealing keys as in Malachi 4: 5,6: “Behold, I will send you Elijah the prophet before the coming of the great and dreadful day of the Lord. And he shall turn the heart of the fathers to the children, and the heart of the children to their fathers, lest I come and smite the earth with a curse.
6. The Gathering of the Elect as in Jeremiah 50:4 “In those days and in that time, saith the Lord, the children of Israel shall come, they and the children of Judah together, going and weeping; they shall go, and seek the Lord their God.
7. The destruction and purification prior to and during the Second Coming.
8. Deliverance for the faithful.
9. The Second Coming
10. The premillennial and millennial state of the faithful.
This vast teaching of Moroni to Joseph that night was supported by many, many scriptures, but let’s go back to the one in Malachi with which we are so familiar about turning the heart of the fathers to the children and the children to the fathers, that also shows up in Doctrine and Covenants 2. It is an indication of how important it is that it actually shows up in various forms in all of our books of scripture. It is clearly in Malachi; in Doctrine and Covenants 2; in the Joseph Smith History in the Pearl of Great Price; in Luke 1:17, in 3 Nephi 25:6—and many, many more places.
If we are a people called to prepare the world for the second coming of Christ, this is the way. It is gathering Israel on both sides of the veil. President Russell M. Nelson said, “The Lord is gathering those who are willing to let God prevail in their lives. The Lord is gathering those who will choose to let God be the most important influence in their lives… When we speak of gathering Israel on both sides of the veil, we are referring, of course, to missionary, temple, and family history work. We are also referring to building faith and testimony in the hearts of those with whom we live, work, and serve. Anytime we do anything that helps anyone—on either side of the veil—to make and keep their covenants with God, we are helping to gather Israel.” (Russell M. Nelson, “Let God Prevail” https://www.churchofjesuschrist.org/study/general-conference/2020/10/46nelson?lang=eng )
And a great part of that gathering is in this week’s scripture of turning the hearts of the children to their fathers and the hearts of the fathers to their children.
And in this section 2 of the Doctrine and Covenants, received September 22, 1823 it is noteworthy to see that God said that Elijah the prophet would come and on April 3, 1836, he did come to the Kirtland Temple to restore those sealing powers. A prophecy given. A prophecy fulfilled.
That’s all for today. We’re Scot and Maurine Proctor and this has been Meridian Magazine’s Come Follow Me podcast. Next week we will study Doctrine and Covenants Sections 3-5, “My Work Shall Go Forth” Thanks to Paul Cardall for our music and to Michaela Proctor Hutchins who produces this show. See you next week.