It is interesting that Brett can't see how the four men mentioned in the early part of this article aren't silenced. They are very much silenced in the organizations where their voice had previously been openly welcomed and valued. The organizations are free to continue to express their own liberal and widely accepted opinions, but Vidmar, Eich, Sainz and Holland must now be either out of the organization or be very careful and cautious about how and what they say and do if they want to stay in the organization. They are censored and censured, while those who silenced them continue to enjoy free expression of opinion. The death of being able to stand up for moral and right in a public (or private for that matter) institution should be a cause of great concern for us all.
BrettJune 25, 2015
In each of the four cases the author cited the men (Vidmar, Eich, Sainz, and Holland) exercised their freedom to speak their conscience. The organizations that they represented then spoke their conscience in response. Neither side was silenced (as you claim). The use of these examples leads me to believe that the author thinks the organizations should have no say in who represents them.
DanJune 21, 2015
As a mormon, I lived through Prop 8 on the Bay Area peninsula and I laugh when I hear some of my less-knowledgable 'hipster' SLC mormon friends talk about how it was/is all about 'tolerance' and 'love'.
I voted my conscience and went out to neighborhoods to respectfully support traditional marriage, but I can say that I feared for my, and my family's, safety and didn't dare put up a sign for Prop 8 at home.
Tolerance and love had no place for the traditional family minority in the Bay Area as mormons who donated were targeted via a 'hit list' that was circulated online that identified them by name, location and religion. I downloaded a copy back then so that this ugly discrimination against a minority group wasn't lost to history, since the victors write the history books.
We were bullied, hurt and silenced. We lost jobs, and our homes and places of worship were vandalized. In a broadcast one night to traditional family supporters at the beginning of Prop 8, the Brethren warned what would happen if we weren't successful in supporting traditional marriage. I am in awe how most of what they warned about has happened or is in the process of happening now. Watchmen upon the towers, indeed.
anneJune 18, 2015
I found this article really good and we as LDS need to be advocates for the sanctity of marriage between a man and a woman. That said, are we just as strong in our convictions when it comes to anyone having sexual relations outside of marriage? Having children out of wedlock? Living together without being married has been the biggest demise of the family in our societies thus far. Are we just as vocal about that? or have we become "tolerant"? Incidentally, I was watching a TV programme where couples cook for each other at their homes and they score each other on the evening. There were 3 coulpes in this programme, two opposite sex and one gay couple. The only couple that were married were the gay couple!! How crazy is that?! It seems that now in our "world" the only people interested in getting married are the same sex attracted. Everyone else seems to be happy to just co habit. How sad that something like marriage, that is such a blessing and so easy for straight couples , is not precious enough for them to embark on. We as LDS need to stand up and be counted for marriage between a man and a woman, yes. But also for marriage period.
KateJune 17, 2015
Thank you for this and all other Expand pieces. I appreciate the depth and rigor of these articles, and the pondering they inspire. Keep up the good work!
mary janeJune 17, 2015
This argument prepares us for the worst. I too hope we are well-grounded in fundamental doctrine so we will stand up for what is right--that marriage between a man and a woman is ordained of God. My personal experience with such marriage affirms this truth.
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BarrieAugust 4, 2015
It is interesting that Brett can't see how the four men mentioned in the early part of this article aren't silenced. They are very much silenced in the organizations where their voice had previously been openly welcomed and valued. The organizations are free to continue to express their own liberal and widely accepted opinions, but Vidmar, Eich, Sainz and Holland must now be either out of the organization or be very careful and cautious about how and what they say and do if they want to stay in the organization. They are censored and censured, while those who silenced them continue to enjoy free expression of opinion. The death of being able to stand up for moral and right in a public (or private for that matter) institution should be a cause of great concern for us all.
BrettJune 25, 2015
In each of the four cases the author cited the men (Vidmar, Eich, Sainz, and Holland) exercised their freedom to speak their conscience. The organizations that they represented then spoke their conscience in response. Neither side was silenced (as you claim). The use of these examples leads me to believe that the author thinks the organizations should have no say in who represents them.
DanJune 21, 2015
As a mormon, I lived through Prop 8 on the Bay Area peninsula and I laugh when I hear some of my less-knowledgable 'hipster' SLC mormon friends talk about how it was/is all about 'tolerance' and 'love'. I voted my conscience and went out to neighborhoods to respectfully support traditional marriage, but I can say that I feared for my, and my family's, safety and didn't dare put up a sign for Prop 8 at home. Tolerance and love had no place for the traditional family minority in the Bay Area as mormons who donated were targeted via a 'hit list' that was circulated online that identified them by name, location and religion. I downloaded a copy back then so that this ugly discrimination against a minority group wasn't lost to history, since the victors write the history books. We were bullied, hurt and silenced. We lost jobs, and our homes and places of worship were vandalized. In a broadcast one night to traditional family supporters at the beginning of Prop 8, the Brethren warned what would happen if we weren't successful in supporting traditional marriage. I am in awe how most of what they warned about has happened or is in the process of happening now. Watchmen upon the towers, indeed.
anneJune 18, 2015
I found this article really good and we as LDS need to be advocates for the sanctity of marriage between a man and a woman. That said, are we just as strong in our convictions when it comes to anyone having sexual relations outside of marriage? Having children out of wedlock? Living together without being married has been the biggest demise of the family in our societies thus far. Are we just as vocal about that? or have we become "tolerant"? Incidentally, I was watching a TV programme where couples cook for each other at their homes and they score each other on the evening. There were 3 coulpes in this programme, two opposite sex and one gay couple. The only couple that were married were the gay couple!! How crazy is that?! It seems that now in our "world" the only people interested in getting married are the same sex attracted. Everyone else seems to be happy to just co habit. How sad that something like marriage, that is such a blessing and so easy for straight couples , is not precious enough for them to embark on. We as LDS need to stand up and be counted for marriage between a man and a woman, yes. But also for marriage period.
KateJune 17, 2015
Thank you for this and all other Expand pieces. I appreciate the depth and rigor of these articles, and the pondering they inspire. Keep up the good work!
mary janeJune 17, 2015
This argument prepares us for the worst. I too hope we are well-grounded in fundamental doctrine so we will stand up for what is right--that marriage between a man and a woman is ordained of God. My personal experience with such marriage affirms this truth.
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